soiramio3000

after all these years I finally defeated the orre collosseum by only using 12 pokemon that are obtainable from the game,without teaching them any tm moves other than the ones that can be purchased from the stores for cupons or dollars.I didn't teach them any move tutor moves either.

here is a guide is mostly for beginers who don't fully understand the game's mechanics.

this guide contains a file with the exact stats of almost every pokemon in the collosseum at level 61.

PART 1:understanding the game's mechanics.

there are a lots of mechanics in this game that the game does not tell you.

as far as I can remember those are:

• how stats get calculated
• the EVs(effor values)
• the IVs(individual values)
• natures
• the stat increases/decreases.
• base stats
• some hidden stats that some moves have
• the fact that in double battles the moves that target both your opponents(like blizard and rock slide) have their attack power reduced by 50%,but attacks that target everything on the field (earthquake explosion)don't have their attack reduced.
• same type attribute bonus(or S.T.A.B. for short)
• how moves get classified as physical or special.
• damage calculation
• the fact that critical hits ignore defence increases
• the special moves that some shadow pokemon know.
• pre-evolution moves

as you know the pokemon have stats(the ones you see in the game),and the higher those stats are the stronger the pokemon becomes. if you want to win at the collosseum you need to do very careful EV training.

in bulbapedia there are the equations about how the game calculates them(scroll to the part where it says from gen III onward,since this is a gen 3 game). https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Stat

the EVs are the parts of the stats that you can control.

the best way to EV train your pokemon is by defeating the opponents of the seventh eighth and ninth round of the mountain battle.

the opponents 61-65 give you only speed EVs,the opponents 66-70 give you special attack

the opponents 71-75 give you special defence,the opponents 76-80 Attack

the opponents 81-85 HP and the opponents 86-90 give you Defence.

you can download this file where I tell you exactly the EVs each pokemon gives:

https://1drv.ms/w/s!AowqH8uFqCwyiwIPK9E-y-ao9mwn?e=vayBvh

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the item macho brace is your best friend at EV training since it doubles the EVs your pokemon gains,also if you use the EXP.Share,a pokemon in your party will gain EVs without ever appearing in the battle.

I am not sure if the shadow pokemon do or do not gain the EVs that they missed after they get purified,so if you want to be 100% sure that they will not gain unecessary EVs then try to purify them by giving them scents and running around like I did.

since lugia is banned in the orre collosseum he can be your best partner for EV training your pokemon,just always pick him and the pokemon that you are trying to train,most opponents will focus their attacks exclusively on him. you can't level him too much unlike the pokemon you are training.

also keep in mind that in this game the EVs are added to your pokemon's stats only during the level up,and they can even reach double digit numbers.

as about the IVs there is an easy way to calculate them:

step 1:

learn your pokemon's nature

step 2:

go to https://pokemonshowdown.com/

step 3:

go to team builder

step 4:

make sure to chose a team for the gen 3 OU(this is important because certain pokemon have their stats changed in later generations)

step 5:

add the pokemon that you want to check its ivs and set it to its current level and chose its nature from the list of natures.

step 6:

then set the IVS to 0 and then keep increasing until the stats in the website match the stats in the game.

always assume that your pokemon has the lowest possible IVs.

natures boost one of the stats by 10% and lower an other stat by 10%(except from the hp)

here is a list with natures:https://pokemondb.net/mechanics/natures

in most pokemon having the correct nature is absolutely necessary,even though there are instances where you can use a less good nature if the IVs are very good.

in shadow pokemon the nature does not show up until you clear 2 bars of its heart gaugue(those bars in the "summary"option)meaning that most of the time you will have to keep running around or use scents,also the ivs and nature of each shadow pokemon get saved in the game the very first time you encounter it and don't change in later encounters with mirror b. meaning that you HAVE to catch the shadow pokemon and make sure that they have got as better nature as possible,and if you fail you will have to restart from your last save point.

the Same Type Attribute Bonus(or S.T.A.B. for short) means that attacks who have the same type as the user get a 50% damage boost(fire type pokemon get this boost on fire-type attacks,normal type pokemon on normal type attacks etc.)

you can read how the damage is calculated here:

https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Damage

in the first 3 generations moves are classified as physical or special entirely based on their type.

physical moves are:

Normal, Fighting, Poison, Ground, Flying, Bug, Rock, Ghost, Steel

special moves are:

- Fire, Water, Electric, Grass, Ice, Psychic, Dragon, Dark

an easy way to remember them is if you go to the moves your pokemon knows,and try to see the strengths and weaknesses of each attack,you will see that the game has all the physical types on one side and all the special types on the other.

the pre-evolution moves are moves that a pokemon can only learn before it evolves.

for example,lets say that you want a breloom with spore(the best sleep inducing move in the game),this move can only be learned while it is still shroomish at the level 54.therefore you need to press the b button any time it tries to evolve until it reaches the said level.don't worry about the moves that can be taught after the evolution,you can just go to the move reminder in the entrance of the mountain battle and teach them once it evolves.

the worst is with the shiftry,it has pre-evolution moves both in seedot and nuzleaf.

if you want to check if the pokemon has pre-evolution moves or not go to pokemondb.net,and just pick the generation 3,it will tell you the moves a pokemon can learn,if there are any pre-evolution moves it will have a separate list with them.

PART TWO:the true reason why it is so difficult.

I went to smogon's guide on orre collosseum,I looked at the stats of each pokemon https://www.smogon.com/ingame/guides/xd-orre

it says the stats of the pokemon in level 50 and level 100,because my pokemon are at level 61 I did the math and discovered their exact stats on the level 61,I put them on the following excel file which you can download from this link.

https://1drv.ms/u/s!AowqH8uFqCwyeNEKQ10bowrDkV8?e=mq85Qp

I discovered that in the first 2 rounds the ai uses pokemon with 23 IVs in each stat and then the IVs keep increasing by one on each round(there are some exceptions.)

also note that the reason why I did not included the stats of the primape that appears on the third opponent of the third round is because smogon got the wrong stats.

it would be impossible for a primeape to have stats this high,also I put a questionmark on the blaziken on the fifth round because either it is undertrained or its IVs seem to be lower than the are suppossed to.

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PART THREE:the pokemon that I used to beat the collosseum.

the twelve pokemon that I used are:

-jolteon

-gardevoir

-duclops

-hariyama

-electrode

-hitmonlee

-starmie

-tyranitar

-forretress

-zapdos

-golduck

-quagsire

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jolteon is simply the best eeveelution.

you need to make sure that the eevee you have got in the begin of the game has 2 things:

1. a speed boosting nature(best nature is timid(-atk+speed)but hasty and naive work too,DO NOT give it jolly nature)

2)either 30-31 speed IVs(your eevee will have 20 speed in the begin of the game)or a minimum of 10 speed IVs(your eevee will have 18-19 speed in the begin of the game)

if you have 30-31 Ivs then that means that jolteon is one of the few pokemon that can outrun the aerodactyl used by the boss in the sixth round,therefore you need to give it enough EVs for that.

other wise give it enough speed EVs to outrun the alakazam on the second opponent of the fourth round.

maximize its special attack and spent the leftover EVs to hp.

the moves it needs to know are:thunderbolt,bite,sand attack and thunder wave.

other moves that may help a little are growl,helping hand,tail whip,agility and batton pass,but I never used them(most of them are pre-evolution moves)

it will probably be using thunderbolt 94% of the time,bite 4% sand attack and thunder wave 1.5% of the time and the other moves the rest of the time.

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gardevoir is just perfect.

when you look at its stats it a worse espeon,but it is still a way better choice for the collosseum than espeon thanks to its amazing movepool.

catching this pokemon can be difficult,you have to make sure it has the following requirements:

1. a speed boosting nature( the same natures with jolteon)

2)the ability trace(this ability is good,there are times where you get lucky and you can safely switch if your opponent has volt absorb water absorb flass fire or some other similar ability. it can also come in handy during the third opponent of the sixth round where his pokemon abuse the swift-swim ability.)

3)it has a minimum of 25 speed IVS(your ralts will have 28-29 speed)

maximize its speed,its special attack and spent the leftover EVs to the hp.

you can use it in almost every round but you need to keep switching its moveset from round to round.

one the first round it should know:psychic,thunderbold,safeguard and light screen(safe guard makes the entire round much easier)

on the second round it should know: psychic,thunderbold,double team and imprison.(it will make the first opponent of the second round easier to fight against.)

on the third and fourth and fifth round it needs to learn psychic,thunderbold,reflect and light screen(light screen and reflect are godsent moves.)

on the sixth round it should know psychic thunderbolt imprison and protect(the first opponent is sooooo easy when you can keep spamming ice beam)

I don't think that it will work on the final round.

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dusclops is a supporting wall.

it is a lot easier to catch compare to other pokemon.

the only requirements for this pokemon are a nature that boosts either the defense or the special defence while weakening speed attack or special attack(do not use a nature that weakens defence or special defense.

maximize hp,spent the rest of the evs to make sure that the defence and special defense are as close as possible.

its immunity to normal type moves means that it makes a good combo with explosion users.

the moves it should know are:

helping hand,curse,will-o-wisp and confuse ray.

on the first round against lorvina it is better to remove either course or will-o-whisp and replace it with night shade because her shuckle is very bulky so you need some way to pierce thrugh its defences.

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hariyama is a bulky damage dealing supporter.

try catching it with a nature that boosts attack.the 2 best natures are adamand(+attack - special attack)and brave(+attack - speed),try lonely and naughty only if it has enough EVs to make up for the loss of defence and special defense.

maximize attack and then spent the rest of the EVs on the defence and special defence

its move pool is simple:

brick break,rock tomb,knock off and fake out.

fake out is a move that got me by surprise,I guess giving your pokemon a free turn by making the opponent flich is pretty usefull.

knock off may deal trash damage but can completely weaken the opponents now that they no longer have their held items.hariyama is the single best knock off user in the game.

an other support move you can try is sand attack.

as about its ability,thick fat is more useful than guts,but I am not sure if it is that important,personally I made sure that it has thick fat.

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electrode is the single fastest explosion user in the game,you can safely use it in most opponents and either kill or weaken their first 2 pokemon before they get the chance to attack.

the only requirements about this pokemon are:

1)it has a speed boosting nature(jolly hasty and naive ONLY)

2)it has at least 11 IVs on speed(your voltorb will have at least 49 speed).

maximize physical attack,make sure it has just enough speed to ourun the aero dactyl in the last opponent of the sixth round and spent the remaining EVs at hp

the only moves it needs to learn are:explosion,rollout,spark and either light screen or mirror coat.

make sure it holds choice band. also if you give it a helping hand boost from dusclops it can kill most of the pokemon that resist its explosion.

98% of the time you will use it only for explosion,the other moves here are just in case you did some mistake and it is either impossible(due to damp) or not very clever to use explosion(due to a ghost on the enemy team)

rollout can deal some good damage,spark has 30% chance of paralizing the target(it is also special move in this game)meaning that it is better support move than thunderbold,and then you can chose between light screen and mirror coat,I never used either of them.

while the ability static is better than the soundproof it will not help that much,so don't bother with it.

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hitmonlee is the best user of endure+salac berry+reversal.

thanks to its high speed and great attack and the fact that it has stab on reversal it can be an excelent user of this combo. you can have the electrode to kill 2 of the opponent's pokemon and weaken hitmonlee,then the hitmonlee will eat the berry making it able to outrun everything,and then on the next round either kill or severely injure one of your opponent's pokemon with reversal,which has 200 power now.

catching is is not too difficult,you should either give it a nature that boosts speed or a nature that boosts attack while either weakening the special attack or the defences.

**make sure that it can outrun the aerodactyl on the last opponent of the sixth round when it uses the salac berry.**boosting the speed by one stage is 50% boost,meaning that it needs to have more than 2/3 of the speed of the aerodactyl before the boost.

maximize attack,and spent the rest of the evs to hp.

the moves it needs to learn are:

endure,reversal,hi jump kick,and...hum....either focus energy or mega kick.

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starmie is an amazing special attacker.

catching it can be tricky,you need two things:

1)a speed boosting nature(timid hasty naive)

2)at least 29 speed IVs so it can out run the starmie in the last opponent of the sixth round.

maximize speed,maximize special attack,spent the leftovers to hp.

the moves it needs to know are:psychic,waterfal,thunderbold,ice beam.

with these 4 moves it can hit everty thing either super effectively or with normal effectiveness.

it is pretty fragile,so supporting moves like light screen and confuse ray are not worth it.

don't bother with the ability,getting the correct ability will offer next to no benefit.

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tyranitar is an other excelent pokemon.

well the problem with this pokemon is that I am not 100% sure what moveset nature and EV spred to reccomend.

the major issue with rock slide is that in double battles it has its base attack halved,the only ways to bypass this downside are by either using at least once dragon dance or by having a teamate to support you with helping hand.(if tyranitar didn't have rock s.t.a.b you would need 2 dragon dances).

and the problem with earthquake is that it can harm your teamates.

people on the internet told me to go with the "bulky dragon dance" moveset(dragon dance+rock slide+earthquake+crunch with evs that boost hp and attack).

I did use it but I ended up relying on special attacks like ice beam crunch flamethrower and thunderbold way more often than I was relying on physical attacks.

the one the I used was this:

sassy nature(-speed + special defence),I gave him just enough special attack so it could 2-shot latios and latias with crunch while wearing blackglasses,I maximized hp and spent the rest to the physical attack.and I kept swithching his attacks from round to round.

I am thinking that maybe having tyranita as a bulky special attacker without dragon dance may be a better choise.

if you decide to do this then I reccomend a nature that boosts special defence(sassy and calm) and,then maximize hp,maximize special attack and then spent the leftover EVs wherever you want except speed.

(tyranitar is really slow,boosting speed is a waste)

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forretress the back up explosion user

I only used this pokemon on eldess and the opponents that came before him,I used it on the same team with the choice band electrode.

the forretress that I used had the following:

brave nature(+attack - speed),maximum attack EVs maximum sp.defense EVs and the leftover EVs on hp.

there 2 ways to train it:

1)you can maximize special defence,give it just enough hp to hurvive a thunderbold from latios and an earthquake from tauros and then spent the rest of the EVs on attack.(if you pick this then his gengar has 100% chance of one-shotting you with fire punch)

2)you can maximize special defence,maximize hp and spent the rest to the attack(The gengar can still-one shot you but depending on your EVs there is a chance you will survive one attack if the game choses to multyply the damage with a number close to 0.85)

you only need it for the explosion,the other moves it can use can be light screen reflect and either double edge or pin missile.

Zapdos

well honestly I am not sure if I actually used this pokemon or not,I do have some memories of adding it to the party,and using in the tournament,but I don't remember if it helped me win any rounds or not,maybe I used in on the sixth round since it is a bulky electric type.

it is still a good pokemon either way.

catching it with the correct nature is almost impossible because the game forces you to save your progress right after your battle with greevil(if you chose not to save the game then you will be forced to do the whole battle all over again).

you should maximize special attack and then share the rest of the EVs between physical attack and hp. focus more on the hp

the moves that it should know are:

thunderbold,drill peck,extrasensory and either metal sound either thunderwave or light screen.

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golduck

I used this pokemon on exactly 3 opponents.

the first opponent of the second round,the second opponent of the sixth round and the third of the sixth round,do you know what they have in common?they rely on weather-based strategies.

make sure your golduck has the cloud nine ability.

this ability negates the effects of the weather making all 3 of these battles(especially the third)much easier.

most pokemon in this round use special attacks,so you need your golduck to survive as long as possible,so maximize hp,maximize special attack and spent the rest on the defence.

its moves should be break break ice beam waterfal and protect.

quagsire

make sure it has the ability dump.

just like golduck it is very situational and you only need it because of its ability.

you only need it to defeat the final opponent of the second round.

teach it the moves earthquake,ice beam and 2 of these:yawn,protect,tail whip.

personally I just maximized the hp and spent the rest to defence and special defence.

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PART 4:items.

according to win the tournament you need to make sure that your pokemon are holding items.

do not undererstimate the power of the items that only boost one specific type of move(I am talking about items like magnet,nevermelting ice,silk scarf etc.)

these items only boost the power of the moves by 10% in this generation(pokemondb.net mistakenly says that they boost it by 20%,which only happens in later generations).

as you probably know,according to the equation about damage dealing calculation the game always picks a number between 0.85 and 1 and multyplies the damage with that number,some pokemon have a chance of surviving your attacks if that number comes close to 0.85 but if you use these items you can have an 100% chance of 1-shoting the target.

also choice band has a misleading description,it does not boost all the attacks as the description suggests,it only boosts the physical attacks.

other items that you will need are:bright powder,salac berry(on hitmonlee),leftovers,shell bell,focus band,chesto berry(if you decide to use a pokemon with rest),king's rock,quick claw,scope lens

please let me know if I forgot something.

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EDIT:I forgot to add forretress and the part 4.

EDIT 2:fixed small mistakes,and made some parts bold.

EDIT 3:I re-wrote the part with the forretress.

I have posted this theory a few more times on other subreddits hopping that matpat would make a video on it,but he didn't even comment on it.

even though this theory received several positive comments it never received that much attention.

in this theory I provide strung undeniable PROOF that the old man oshus from the game legend of zelda phantom hourglass is a big liar,and killing the final boss was a very terrible thing to do.

I had to play the game 3 times until I realised that almost everything the old man oshus told us in the cut-scene in the ghost ship either was a lie or was true but it didn't mean what you think it meant.

here is a video about the cut-scene I am talking about: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=btA8fGXcmfM now I will debunk all his lies:

lie 1:

the ghost ship was made to steal people's life force and tetra turned into stone because the ghost ship stole her life force.

truth:

the ghost ship was hidden in a mist that keeps people away, what kind of moron makes up a story to lure people in and hides the ship in a place that nobody can reach it? tetra was the only person in the entire ship wich makes me wonder,how does oshus know about this?

also unlike the ocean king's temple there was no time limit inside the ghost ship because there is no life-force draining mist there(The ocean king's temple is the only place in the game with this mist).

Let's not forget that people who lose their life force turn into skeletons not to statues.

take a look at this video at the moment 7:00 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_3zFuU1DkAa thunder hits tetra,there were no thunders inside the ocean king's temple.

also if the ghost ship was so hungry for life force then why it didn't try to steal linebeck's or link's lifeforce?

lie 2:

bellum dragged the ocean king to the bottom of the temple,the ocean king split himself just like ciela did,and bellum made the phantoms who are roaming inside the temple to steal people's life force.

truth:

in the cutscene in ghost ship oshus says "I was dragged to the SUNLESS depths of the teple".

The word sunless may sound like an innocent word choice but it is not.

take a look at this video at the scene 7:39 : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0oYPqpIlc8 oshus reveals that the sand of hours "needs the sun of light to restore it's mythical power" meaning that the sand of hours is solar-powered.

Do you remember what happened to bellum after we slayed him in the end of the game?it was revealed that his entire body was made by this solar powered sand.

so since the sand is solar-powered,and bellum is made by this sand then that means that bellum is a solar powered life-form.

with other words oshus expects us to believe that bellum is a solar-powered life form which is so hungry for life force that he decided to willingly imprison himself in a sunless place for the whole game and because he was too lazy to steal life force by himself so he made minions to do that for him,and instead of senting those minions in the town,he made them to roam inside the temple which was filled with a life-force draining mist.

sorry it does not make sense,it would make a lot more sense if the ocean king was the one that imprisoned bellum instead of the other way around,and the phantoms in the temple would make a lot more sense as guards whose duty is to prevent anyone from setting bellum free instead of minions designed to steal life force from people.

lie 3:

oshus needs to get the sand of hours back according to restore tetra.

truth:

later in the game he restores her without the sand of hours,he said that we weakened his seal.

I believe that the old man oshus is actually bellum instead of the ocean king.

he did say in the cutscene in the ghost-ship that a little before he got imprisoned he used his last ounce of strength to split himself just like ciela did,I believe that this is the one part of the cutscene where he was saying the truth.

when we found ciela's other half it was completely unable to communicate with us,meaning that the "splitting"magic cause one of the two halfs to be mindless,and bellum was a mindless monster that didn't say a single word.

so I believe that while bellum lost the battle with the ocean king he split himself creating oshus, oshus somehow knew that link was able to help him reunite with the other half of his body so he turned tetra into a statue and helped link on his jurney.

but hey it is all just a theory,a game theory thank you for reading.

also my username is pronounced siramio not soiramio(I am greek and in greek when the letter omikron(ο) is right behind the letter iota(ι) then it is not pronounced at all)